The Reverends on Meet the Press Part 2

More on the continuing analysis of Nov 28th Meet the Press:

Marriage.

Falwell and most born again/evangelical Christians prefer to use St Paul's letters as the basis of moral theology. They do not take into account that these letters were written to specific people in a specific time and place for particular reasons. Therefore what he wrote 2000 years ago from Palestine during the Roman Empire is not necessarily meant for us today unless you're a born again Christian looking to restrict some civil rights and then St Paul is just perfect for that.

I studied St Paul's letters in the seminary and once I learned where he was coming from, I hated him less. St Paul should be used sparingly when arguing Christianity though as he is so misunderstood. I'm in disagreement with the early church fathers for putting these Pauline chapters in the New Testament because if you just read them without any historical and situational background, they seemingly contradict Jesus in the Gospels and St Paul looks like a male chauvinist pig. But then again the early church fathers probably liked that. They took a lot of St Paul to heart in forming some unnecessary dogma.

The first thing we must know is that at the time of St Paul, Christians believed that Jesus' return was imminant. They expected Jesus to return in his firey spaceship and gather up his people at any minute. This preoccupation with the end of the world is evident in Paul's letters and evident by the christians in the first century who volunteered to be thrown to the lion's den (they weren't going to miss much since the world was ending anyway). St Paul lived in the Roman Empire during a time when women had no rights. It was a patriarchal society. Men were in control. It was not dogma.

When Falwell or Dr Land whipped out some St Paul quotes to back up their ridiculous positions, it became evident to me that neither on had any real biblical training. And here ya go...

TIM RUSSERT: We can try to find common ground, but there are differences, and I want to see just how profound they are. The Southern Baptist Convention in 1998 passed this statement on the family: "...A wife is to submit herself graciously to the servant leadership of her husband... She...has the God-given responsibility to respect her husband and to serve as his helper in managing the household..."

And, Reverend Land, you went on to explain it this way: "If a husband does not want his wife to work outside the home, then she should not work outside the home." Is that your vision of America?

DR. LAND: It's my vision for Christian families. I don't think that the law has anything to do with it. That was a statement about the theological belief of Southern Baptists. And, you know, George Will had a real great answer for that when somebody asked him, "Where'd they get this stuff?" And he pulled out the Bible and turned to Ephesians, chapter five: "He got--we got it from Ephesians, chapter five." We almost needed to footnote the Apostle Paul when he said that "Husbands should love their wives the way Christ loves the church," which means husbands will always put their wives' needs above their own. And they are to be the head of their home, which means that they're responsible. It's a servant leadership role.

It is not a servant leadership role today. St Paul is actually making a radical departure from the usual servant leadership role of the time.
These passages seem as if St Paul is anti-women but in fact he holds men to very high standards too and does not expect them to treat women as submissives or lesser beings in a marriage. So where Dr Land comes up with this "women shouldn't work outside the home" nonsense as biblically inspired, he is just plain wrong.

"Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord.
For the husband is the head of the wife , even as Christ is the head of the church : and he is the saviour of the body. Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing . Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; (from Ephesians 5)

Paul doesn't expect men to only be on the receiving end of the marriage deal. It's a 2 way street. Paul expects a husband to love his wife so much that he is willing to die for her. If a husband truly loves his wife, he isn't going to demand that she stay at home 24/7 if that is not her wish. Get it? Good. I can't believe I defended St Paul. He's not my hero. But lets move on to another letter of St Paul that discusses marriage.

Here, St Paul only recommends marriage for those who are weak willed and lacking self control. (I just love this):

Now concerning the things about which you wrote, it is good for a man not to touch a woman. But I say to the unmarried and to widows that it is good for them if they remain even as I (single). But if they do not have self-control, let them marry; for it is better to marry than to burn with passion. (1 Corinthians 7:1,8,9 )

When my dad was growing up Catholic, this was your choice: You either become a priest or get married. Period. My favorite line is "But if they do not have self-control, let them marry; for it is better to marry than to burn with passion." It looks like St Paul is saying that marriage is a cure for horniness and those who get married are weak willed. Notice how the evangelists kind of skip this part of 1 Corinthians? St Paul is urging people who are living in the supposed end times to really try to refrain from getting married because technically everyone should be on watch for Jesus in the sky. It makes sense from a theological point of view. Evangelicals also believe that these are the end times and I am surprised that they haven't picked up on this passage and used it. It would make for fun debates.

MR. RUSSERT: I want to ask Reverend Falwell about something and broaden the conversation. We talked about Iraq and the war on terrorism. Something that you said two days after September 11, when you were with Reverend Pat Robertson: "I fear... that [September 11th] is only the beginning. ...If, in fact, God continues to lift the curtain and allow the enemies of America to give us probably what we deserve ... I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle ... all of them who have tried to secularize America -- I point the finger in their face and say `you helped this happen.'"

DR. FALWELL: And I went on to say in a sleeping church, a lethargic church likewise is responsible. I do believe, as Ben Franklin said, that God rules in the affairs of men and of nations. I believe that when God blesses a nation, as he's blessed America for a lot of reasons, things happen that don't happen other places. I believe when we defy the Lord, I think we pay a price for it. So I do believe in the sovereignty of God.

Jerry Falwell, always eager to blame others for any misfortune clearly placed the blame on homosexuals for 9/11 and on churches for not making it clear to the sheep that if they sin, God will in fact, punish us... deliberately. Falwell leaves out the part that really really shitty foreign policy by a greedy power hungry government had something to do with 9/11.

When Falwell said this he was right though, "I believe when we defy the Lord, I think we pay a price for it." Another way to say it is: What goes around comes around or You get what you pay for. Those who follow Jesus truly and/or those who are ethical, and are sensitive to the needs of the poor and the oppressed, those who put people before money (corporations) are less likely to be attacked. Anyone can be a greedy piece of shit. You don't have to be an atheist, homosexual, feminist or an abortionist. You can be a rich white man working in government or a church and cause a punishment to come on you and your country in the form of al Qaida. I'm just saying...

more later

I mean when they dropped the towel she's naked!

More hypocrisy from Lush Bimbo:

• Lush Bimbo had this to say about Desperate Housewives meets Monday Night Football (from NY Times): "I was stunned!" he told his listeners. "I literally could not believe what I had seen. ... At various places on the Net you can see the video of this, and she's buck naked, folks. I mean when they dropped the towel she's naked. You see enough of her back and rear end to know that she was naked. There's no frontal nudity in the thing, but I mean you don't need that. ...I mean, there are some guys with their kids that sit down to watch 'Monday Night Football.' "

Oh my God, the children saw some naked woman's back. Oh the humanity! I hope these folks who watch football never go to the beach. I was so traumatized by Nipplegate that I haven't been able to watch football this season. I'm surprised anyone with family values still watches football. Lush Bimbo doesn't want to see any nakedness during a sweet family values kind of game like football but he has no problem with torture:

• Lush Bimbo, May 6th on Abu Ghrab torture: "The thing though that continually amazes -- here we have these pictures of homoeroticism that look like standard good old American pornography , the Britney Spears or Madonna concerts or whatever, and yet the Libs upset about the mistreatment of these prisoners thought nothing of sitting back while mass graves were being filled with three to 500,000 Iraqis during the Saddam Hussein regime."

I've never seen a Britney or Madonna concert but do they torture victims during their shows?

• Lush Bimbo, May 5th on feminism:"I think a lot of the American culture is being feminized. I think the reaction to the stupid torture is an example of the feminization of this country."

Yes we are all a bunch of pussies for being outraged at pictures of our troops torturing Iraqi's.

• Lush Bimbo, May 4th on Abu Ghrab torture: CALLER: It was like a college fraternity prank that stacked up naked men -- LIMBAUGH: Exactly. Exactly my point! This is no different than what happens at the Skull and Bones initiation and we're going to ruin people's lives over it and we're going to hamper our military effort, and then we are going to really hammer them because they had a good time. You know, these people are being fired at every day. I'm talking about people having a good time, these people, you ever heard of emotional release? You ever heard of need to blow some steam off?

College pranks, huh? Is that what they do at conservative colleges? No one tortured anyone to blow off steam where I went to school. We had too much homework. I went to a liberal wussy Catholic College. We blew off steam at the local bar (as all good Irish Catholics do).

• Lush Bimbo, May 6th on Abu Ghrab torture: "And these American prisoners of war -- have you people noticed who the torturers are? Women! The babes! The babes are meting out the torture.

Babes? Family values? This piece of shit is the mouthpiece for the GOP? May the God of the GOP help them.

Limbaugh quotes from MediaMatters.org

The Reverends on Meet the Press Part 1

by blondesense

The discussion with Rev. Al Sharpton, Rev. Jim Wallis, Dr Land and Dr Falwell aired on Meet the Press Sunday morning. What I learned is that Southern Baptists and fundamentalist Christians have a very narrow understanding of the bible and an incomplete understanding of family values and life issues. Simply quoting bible passages out of context and not once using Jesus as a reference in their "christian" arguments should be highly suspicious to anyone with a critical mind. To someone with an advanced degree in theology, it's an affront to modern biblical scholarship and a denial of God's continuing revelation to humankind.

It was no problem for Dr's Land and Falwell to agree with the war in Iraq while going on and about about abortion being murder. They cut off Rev Wallis when he tried to speak about what Jesus really taught. They would change the subject, accuse the other in a backhanded way of being anti-American or unchristian.

REV. WALLIS: But, Jerry, when you say things like what you just quoted, and you say God is pro-war, and so many things that you sometimes say...
DR. FALWELL: I said there is a just war in a theological position.
REV. WALLIS: You said God is pro-war.
DR. FALWELL: I don't believe God loves war. Everybody hates war.
REV. SHARPTON: But you said it was pro-Christian.
REV. WALLIS: Jerry, there are millions and millions of Christians who want the nation to know that you don't speak for them...
REV. SHARPTON: That's right.
REV. WALLIS: ...that Jesus, our Jesus isn't pro-rich, pro-war and only pro-American. We don't find that Jesus anywhere in the Bible.
DR. FALWELL: I don't believe that either. But I was also against Adolf Hitler, and if you had been...
REV. WALLIS: Well, most of us were.
DR. FALWELL: If you had been the president in World War II, we'd all be speaking German now.

Falwell can't argue rationally. No wonder Falwell has this idea that he is right. He comes out with the most inane rationale that usually leaves people dumbfounded and speechless.

REV. WALLIS: You know, we're not--no one's pro-abortion. How do you prevent unwanted pregnancies? I'd like to find some common ground to work together to dramatically reduce the abortion rate. On so many of these issues, we get in the polarized, ideological debates and then we don't talk about to solve the problem.
DR. FALWELL: You're a preacher, aren't you?
REV. WALLIS: "How do we make abortion"--Democrats--"safe, legal and rare?" Well, they're keeping it legal, but let's try to make abortion truly rare in the society. That is a common ground around which I think a lot of people, pro-life and pro-choice could and should support.
DR. FALWELL: Jim, let me ask you a question. Did you vote for John Kerry?
REV. WALLIS: I did vote for John Kerry.
DR. FALWELL: Now, he is pro-choice. How can you as an ordained minister--you are an ordained minister, right?
REV. WALLIS: Jerry--Jerry...
DR. FALWELL: How could you vote for some--I wouldn't vote for my mother if she were pro-choice.
REV. WALLIS: Yeah. You endorsing George Bush. That's fine. But you also called--you ordained him. You said all Christians could only vote for him. That's ridiculous. There are Christians who voted for deep reasons of faith for both candidates.
DR. FALWELL: Well, I don't think--I can't command anybody. I can only take the Bible seriously. You're certainly going to have to--Psalm 139:13-16--believe that life is sacred from conception on...

Once again, Falwell goes to the OT to find a passage to support his faux "pro-life" position. Of course all life is sacred. Progressives believe that. Being pro-life means you actually are pro-life across the board. Our country is in the active violation of many Christian and human ethics in pursuing the war on Iraq which Falwell's supposed family values organization refuses to address. What is he going to say? If we didn't attack Iraq, we'd all be speaking Iraqi?

REV. WALLIS: And Jerry, there are 3,000 verses in the Bible about the poor--about the poor.
DR. FALWELL: And I'm for all of those, too. But George Bush has taken the initiative because of the Democrats
REV. WALLIS: The Republican agenda--the Republican agenda was not satisfactory to many who support him.
REV. SHARPTON: Well, 1.8 million people added to the poverty lines in the last four years under George Bush. But, Reverend, I think you have the right to vote for George Bush. I defend your right to do that even though I disagree with you. We're talking about you not having the right to therefore bar others from exercising their personal decisions.

Jim Wallis was trying to say that there are over 3,000 references to the poor in the bible. Taking care of the poor is the most important issue in the bible. Why? Because humanity and ethics centers on how we take care of each other on earth overall. Modern theologians have concluded that the way God works in the world is by our treatment of the poor and those on the margins of society. Abortion is only one life issue. There is genocide happening in other parts of the world. Our country is killing tens of thousands of innocent Iraqis. We have more and more poor people in America every day. Many of them work fulltime jobs and they are living below the poverty level. These are all life issues. Family values and christian values. There are no exceptions. either you are pro-life all the way or you are not pro-life. You may be anti-abortion, but you are not pro life unless you are against capital punishment, poverty and war as well.

REV. SHARPTON: It's strange to me, Reverend, how the right wing wants to privatize public policy and make public private lives. I mean, people have the right to their private decisions.
DR. FALWELL: No, I'm just trying--I'm trying to do what Martin Luther King did. I'm trying to...
REV. SHARPTON: Jesus--Jesus met the woman at the well. She was guilty of adultery. The state said she could be stoned. He stopped the stoning. You would condemn her for that.
DR. FALWELL: We have a home for unwed mothers.
REV. SHARPTON: He wasn't condoning adultery. He was not condoning adultery. He was saying that the state does not have that right to not say...
DR. FALWELL: You guys talk about that. We have a home for unwed mothers. We have a national adoption agency.
REV. SHARPTON: That was not just a mark. That was law on that day. That was law.
DR. FALWELL: You guys are great at spending somebody else's money.

Falwell does not listen to anyone. Look at how he ends the above portion of the conversation. He must have ADD. He has his pro-war, anti-abortion, anti-gay agenda and that's about all he cares about although he claims that he lives by the bible. Ironically, these bible christians are very selective in what parts of the bible they pay attention to.

REV. AL SHARPTON: ...And I think that where a lot of the misinformation and a lot of the debate went awry--and we're not talking about whether or not we don't share values. We're talking about whether we have the right to impose what we believe on people that may disagree with us. Even God gives you a choice of heaven and hell. We don't have a right to tell people we're going to force them to live in a way that we want them to live and, therefore, they're going to heaven. That's where I disagree.
DR. FALWELL: You still owe me a steak dinner.

Sharpton made an excellent point and Falwell did not answer it. As usual. Sharpton's point is that religious views should not be imposed on a secular society. America is secular whether anyone likes it or not. I believe that if anyone is even going to attempt to try to impose their religious beliefs on me, especially if they are Christian which I know all about, then they had better make perfect sense, be consistant and be sensitive to the rights of all the living with no exceptions.

REV. SHARPTON: I will give you a steak dinner. We bet on the election. But you will get a steak dinner, but you will also get a lecture on civil liberties while we eat it.
DR. FALWELL: But I've waited three weeks.

More later...

Greedy Hogs in Angel Costumes

by pissed off patricia

Okay, I admit it. I don't understand how the "faithful" are able to spend all their capital fighting against abortion and gay marriage when the future of our country is threatened by a plague of Greedy Bastards. Many too many of our problems today are the results of greed. We are earth hogs and we are financial hogs. Greedy hogs need to stop gobbling up our future.

I posted a report about the Repubs going after the Endangered Species Act today. There would be no argument with the Act if Americans weren't so damned greedy. It's all about me they cry. It's my land and I'll do any damned thing I want with it. Screw my neighbors both human and animal and plant.

Here's the deal. It's not your land, you're just basically renting some space here on earth. You aren't entitled to mow it down, poison it, rape it and then lay down your responsibilities when they lay you six feet under. No! You are the guardian of that land you are renting. You are responsible for any injuries you cause, because when you're cold and dead, the land still must function if the following generations are going to be able to enjoy its beauty and reap its bounty in the circle of life. Those who use the land entirely for their own personal benefit at the cost of the future are earth hogs.

Next, let's talk about trial lawyers. They wouldn't be talked about at all if it weren't for the greed of the US citizens. Many who wail and moan about lawsuits are first in line if they think they have some opportunity to get free money from someone else. Slip and fall in a store and they yell, get me a lawyer. If a neighbor's dog bites your kid when your kid is in the neighbor's yard, an all-points bulletin goes out for a trial lawyer. Greed is what drives frivolous lawsuits. Personal responsibility is so passé. Lazy opportunist are greedy. They want to take money from someone, no matter what, no matter the cost. I've seen this theory in action. For example, a friend was visiting and his child was acting up around our pool. The friend said nothing to the child, so finally I asked the little kid to stop monkeying around. The friend didn't seem to mind that I had admonished his child. "I said to my friend, I don't want him (the child) to fall and hurt himself." My friend remarked, "If he did fall and hurt himself, I would sue your ass off." I was dumbstruck by the comment. I said, "You would sue me?" He laughed and said, "I wouldn't be suing you. I would just be suing your insurance company. It wouldn't affect you." His logic was insane. Didn't he realize by suing me and my insurance company that he and all other insured would be picking up the tab in our insurance rates? My friend was giving the American example of greed without forethought. Greed steers many, many Americans when it comes to interaction with trial lawyers.

When did Americans begin to believe it was all about them? When did we become such pompous greedy hogs? What makes us believe we have no personal responsibility for what happens to our country? When did greed become a right instead of a sin? Don't talk to me about your moral values until you demonstrate that you have more than two. Don't talk to me about the right to life of a fetus as you spray poison in the air. Don't talk to me about what the bible says about homosexuals while you rob the pockets of your neighbors. Sure, you have the right to your beliefs but you also have a responsibility to the health and welfare of your fellow man and woman. Demonstrate to me that you are aware of what is going on in more places than your greedy, self-centered little world of ignorance and then maybe we can come to some sort of meeting of the minds. While we liberals from hell are trying to protect what is better not only for now but for future generations, you very well meaning conservatives are so busy being greedy with your moral values that you are blind to the hell you are creating for others. As you would force a mother to give birth to a child she is unable to care for, you won't notice that that child will be growing up in a poisoned atmosphere. As you protect the word "marriage" that you so righteously believe belongs only to heterosexuals, you will abuse the very earth we all must share. You are not morally superior. You are earth and financial hogs in angel costumes.

More Bitchin'

by pissed off patricia

WE MUST FIGHT BACK!
BECAUSE EXTINCTION REALLY IS FOREVER!

Here it comes. We knew they would do it and they're going to. This is some very, very sad news.

"Congress taking aim at Endangered Species Act"

This is a part of what you'll read:

"We have hundreds of species that would not be around today if not for the Endangered Species Act," Kostyack said. "Success stories like the whooping crane and the bald eagle and the black-footed ferret are all things we should celebrate and build upon."

Environmentalists said they fear Republican lawmakers are more inclined to try to gut species protections to appease their allies in industry rather than craft changes that will enhance species survival."

and

"For example, the administration has approved a regulatory change allowing the Environmental Protection Agency to take steps toward approval of new pesticides without consulting the wildlife service on risks to wildlife."

and

"Earlier this year, the administration fired a wildlife service biologist after he publicly complained that the agency had manipulated scientific research to appease developers who wanted to build on land critical to the Florida panther, one of the world's most endangered big cats."

First they destroy the plants and animals. What will be next? Who will be next?

Bitchin'

by pissed off patricia

Crime and no punishment. While many in my area of Florida were denied FEMA money, some in Miami stole it with their lies. Please read what happened.

"FEMA Paid $28M Bogus Claims in Dade County, Fla."

is my bush stupid!

It's worth it to deal with watching the ad to read Salon.com.

This article by Sidney Blumenthal describes our illustrious leader at the Clinton Library opening. More embarassement, but at least his did it in front of the "family".

Here's some excerpts:

"Bush tried to push his way past Clinton at the library door to be first in line, against the already accepted protocol for the event, as though the walk to the platform was a contest for alpha male."

About KKKarl Rove: ""You're not such a scary guy," joked his tour guide. "Yes, I am," Rove replied. Walking away, he muttered deliberately and loudly, "I change Constitutions, I put churches in schools ..." "

"On his tour Bush appeared distracted and glanced repeatedly at his watch. When he stopped to gaze at the river, where Secret Service agents were stationed in boats, the guide said, "Usually, you might see some bass fishermen out there." Bush replied: "A submarine could take this place out." "

"Upon entering the tent, Bush, according to an eyewitness, told an aide, "One gulp and we're out of here." He had informed the Clintons he would stay through the lunch, but by the time Peres arose with wine glass in hand the president was gone."

What manners! How much more will bushie lower the bar for American manners?


Anyway, while you're at Salon, there is a story that will cheer you up.
Scrooge's Nightmare
Despite Bush's election, the cranky old conservatives' days are numbered. The future belongs to middle-aged boomers and their kids, who embrace the tolerant values of the '60s.
By Leonard Steinhorn

Excerpts:

"All the claims about mandates and values notwithstanding, the very fact that one-fifth of voters cited moral values means that four-fifths didn't."

and

"How little the "moral values" voter represents the future is evident in surveys of today's youth, who may be the most inclusive, tolerant and socially liberal generation in our nation's history. From the media we hear all about the controversies of the so-called culture war, such as the occasional school superintendent who shuts down all school clubs to keep gay and straight high school students from forming "gay-straight" clubs. But what we don't hear is that these clubs have quietly formed in about 2,800 schools nationwide. In fact, research on young people confirms that they have little patience for intolerance, that they have no problem accepting homosexuality, that most even support the right of gay people to marry."

We're the silent majority. Just because the media likes to report on the big mouthed bigots of America who hide behind bibles, guns and flags, they do not represent the majority of Americans.

And since your at Salon.com, check out this piece by Eric Boehlert, Clinton to ABC News: It's payback time The former president chastises Peter Jennings for ABC's "sleazy" coverage of Whitewater -- and he's right.

Excerpts:

"President Clinton's prime-time interview with ABC on Nov. 18, in conjunction with the opening of the Clinton presidential library, was for the most part a feel-good, nostalgic affair, as Clinton looked back on his presidency with ABC anchor Peter Jennings. But Clinton flashed real irritation when Jennings suggested some historians thought that Clinton's presidency had lacked "moral authority," without mentioning its having been tarnished by independent counsel Kenneth Starr's multiple investigations.

""You don't want to go here, Peter," snapped Clinton, who proceeded to criticize the reporting of ABC News, in particular, in the 1990s. "Not after what you people did and the way you, your network, what you did with Kenneth Starr. The way your people repeated every little sleazy thing he leaked. No one has any idea what that's like."

"In truth, Clinton's criticism of the media's overheated and often conspiratorial scandal coverage could be applied to a host of mainstream news operations. But it was fitting that the comment was directed at ABC, which occupied a unique role amid the seven-year, $70 million media feeding frenzy surrounding Starr's probes. At times ABC, led by reporter Jackie Judd and producer Chris Vlasto, seemed to act as the broadcast counterparts to the print reporters relying on news from the Office of the Independent Counsel -- making an early investment in the Whitewater story and determined to see it pay off. "

... "In 1998 Salon's Joe Conason wrote, "After Murray Waas and I published an article in the Nation about Starr's conflicts of interest ... [a]mong the most hostile responses was a telephone call from ABC producer Chris Vlasto, who has worked the Clinton scandal beat at the network for several years. ... "

"According to Starr himself, when the Monica Lewinsky scandal broke on Jan. 21, 1998, Starr's top deputy, Jackie Bennett, spent the day talking "extensively" with a handful of reporters, including ABC's Judd, the one TV reporter on the shortlist at Starr's office. In November, ABC's loyalty was rewarded when it beat out its network competitors, including CBS's "60 Minutes," by landing the first lengthy television interview with Starr. ... "

Oh puhlease, that Clinton nightmare was such a conspiracy through and through. Did you see the Hunting of A President? Unbelievable. I'm glad Clinton didn't keep his mouth shut. Can you imagine a reporter asking Bush questions that he doesn't like? Oh wait. No one asks bush questions he doesn't like. The media loves bush.

Isn't This Dangerous? Just asking.

(AFP/Gerardo Gomez)

"I think my wife loved Jesus more than she loved me"

Arkansas Woman Killed in Mistaken Rapture
by Elroy Willis

ARKANSAS CITY (EAP) -- A Little Rock woman was killed yesterday after leaping through her moving car's sunroof during an incident best described as a "mistaken rapture" by dozens of eye-witnesses.

Thirteen other people were injured after a twenty-car pile-up resulted from people trying to avoid hitting the woman, who was apparently convinced that the rapture was occurring when she saw twelve people floating up into the air, and then passed a man on the side of the road who she believed was Jesus.

"She started screaming `He's back! He's back!' and climbed out through the sunroof and jumped off the roof of the car," said Everet Williams, husband of 28-year-old Georgann Williams who was pronounced dead at the scene.

"I was slowing down but she wouldn't wait till I stopped," Williams said. She thought the rapture was happening and was convinced that Jesus was gonna lift her up into the sky," he went on to say.

"This is the strangest thing I've seen since I've been on the force," said Paul Madison, first officer on the scene.

Madison questioned the man who looked like Jesus and discovered that he was on his way to a toga costume party, when the tarp covering the bed of his pickup truck came loose and released twelve blow-up sex dolls filled with helium, which then floated up into the sky.

Ernie Jenkins, 32, of Fort Smith, who's been told by several of his friends that he looks like Jesus, pulled over and lifted his arms into the air in frustration and said "Come back," just as the Williams' car passed him, and Mrs. Williams was sure that it was Jesus lifting people up into heaven as they drove by him.

"I think my wife loved Jesus more than she loved me," the widower said when asked why his wife would do such a thing.

When asked for comments about the twelve sex dolls, Jenkins replied "This is all just too weird for me. I never expected anything like this to happen."


PS. This is an urban legend.

more of God's will and handiwork

"God always stays ahead. He's a pro." Hannibal Lector, Red Dragon

Since it is Thanksgiving, I hope that you are able to give thanks for a family that understands, for a church that supports, and a government with priorities in order. Why is it that we expect the mentally ill to support themselves?

"DALLAS -- The minister of a woman who admitted killing her baby daughter by severing the child's arms said Wednesday that her husband seemed emotionally stable but was searching for answers and concerned about how God will judge his wife

"He's concerned, overall, about why this happened and what would happen to her and how does God view her right now," said [the minister], who leads a nondenominational church in Plano that [the parents] have attended with their children.

Dena Schlosser, 35, was charged with capital murder Monday after she calmly told a 911 operator she cut off the arms of 11-month-old Margaret. Police found Schlosser, who had a history of postpartum depression and psychotic symptoms, covered in blood and holding a knife, a church hymn playing in the background.

[The minister] said that when he talked to [the father] on Monday about funeral arrangements, the father seemed to be emotionally stable. He also inquired about his wife's fate. A telephone message left for a [the father] was not returned Wednesday.

"He's concerned about his wife. I mean, who wouldn't be? He asked me: 'What is God saying now? I mean, my wife's in jail,"' [the minister] told The Associated Press. "I said 'John, we'll have to watch the court system and how it works out."'

[The minister], who started Water of Life Church in 1980, said he believes God uses the courts to work his will. He said he told [the father] that although the Bible instructs not to kill, God also forgives.

"God will forgive every sin and he will forgive this woman. He's the only one who can lead her to repentance," [the minister] said. "My basic thing will be simply to pray that Dena will be brought to repentance to God and acknowledge her sin and then she'll be free."

[The minister] said he did not have a close relationship with the Schlossers. He said they attended the church sporadically for about three years. Dena Schlosser and her daughters, ages 6 and 9, attended more often than her husband, he said.

"I'd say hello and that was about it," the minister said. "I don't think anybody here had that much contact with them."

The Schlossers' daughters were placed in temporary custody with Texas' Family and Protective Services after an agency determined their father failed to protect them from their mother.

---30---

Is it really an expression of God's will that Dallas County may try this mentally ill woman for capital murder? Mind you, this is a question from someone who finds it difficult to believe that it was God's will that His Son was also tried for a capital crime.

One of the expressions of God'w will that I recall vividly from interning in the Family/Juvenile Courts in Harris County was watching His children dressed in orange jumpsuits in shackles and chains shuffling out of their holding cells to the courtroom.

The court system in Texas is hell. This family will not be able to afford the excellent legal counsel it is going to take to keep her out of prison and in a mental institution. The State of Texas will probably bill her family for her medication.

Why isn't it God's will that we rise above our ignorance and help make this life bearable rather than worrying that there is a next life?

Eighty-seven percent of Americans believe that evolution played no role in human development. We sprang from God's hands fully formed.

I am wagering if science does not occupy a certain amount of our reality, then understanding mental illness is beyond us.


Mental health must be difficult for some citizens of Texas to understand. We have a difficult time legislating enough money for it, churches have a difficult time seeing that mental illness is not a sin. Does a woman really need prison in order to get the help she needed? If it is a sin to be mentally ill and seeking psychiatric help, and this church didn't necessarily think that it was, but, it didn't help one of the flock when the lamb got lost? How about leaving those children or an infant alone with an obviously ill woman? Where was this woman's husband? He didn't think his wife or his children were in danger? Why didn't he think so?

Very few people in Texas can afford legal counsel skilled enough to fight the state's resources. This case is going to require a level of sophistication most cases don't need and don't receive.

Texas Family and Protective Services isn't indifferent. They are simply moving as much paper across their poorly funded desk as possible. Don't blame them. We are fortunate that they have the college education they do have, we are fortunate that they don't run away but go to their jobs everyday.

Another woman in East Texas killed two of her children and disabled one for life by crushing them with stones. When she got her prescriptions for anti-depressants and anti-psychotic medications, she said, "Why doesn't someone educate us about this? Why don't the schools? Why doesn't the church?" she pleaded.

Hell if I know, sister!

If the people of Texas think that government shouldn't be taxing citizens to pay for mental health then why isn't the church filling that gap? So her government fails her, her health care fails her, her church fails her, her husband fails her.

And she is supposed to confess her sin?

Thanksgiving Prayers

Mark Twain's Prayer for Soldiers (excerpt)


__________________________________

Blondesense Prayer for Liberals

Oh Lord, our God, please give us the courage to unceasingly pester
the government into getting our troops out of Iraq soon
whether they like being there or not
and not sit by and criticize it without doing anything.
Give us the courage to call upon our cable companies
and demand that they take Fox News off our television.
Give us the impetus to travel from all corners of the land
and march on Washington by the millions before inauguration day.
Give us the strength to say no to buying goods that we don't really need.
Especially me, dear Lord, I beseach you.
Help us to truly live in peace and fight all the injustices in the world
with perseverence and little regard for our creature comforts.
May we always practice what we preach.

If you're out there, please help.
Amen

My Holiday Wishes to All

from pissed off patricia

We are quickly approaching the day I happily refer to as National Eating Day. I guess you could also call it National Eating, Watching Football and Napping Day. Maybe even National Tryptophan Day. That would pretty much wrap it up nicely for most of us.

Thanksgiving is supposed to be the day religious people thank their god for all they feel grateful for and for all the wonderful things they have. Things like family, health etc. Non-religious people can be thankful too, they just don't have to write thank you notes to anyone. That's fine.

Luck seems to me to have a lot to do with what you have and don't have. I don't believe a god was punishing my neighbor for being an ass, which my neighbor surely is, by sending two hurricanes here this year. It would be kind of mean to blow the roofs off of so many homes in this area just to punish one jerk. It would be a very costly and very mean sort of way to let one guy know he needs to stop being so damned selfish and demanding. I don't think as Jeb bush does that a god sends hurricanes on a predestined path. I think we were just damned unlucky, unfortunate, call it what you will. I am grateful that the damage wasn't any worse and that we are on our way to total recovery.

I'm grateful that I found the perfect gentleman to call my husband. That wasn't luck, that was determination on my part. No thank you notes to anyone but me for that charming part of my life today. I found him, I love him so much and I'm keeping him, just as I have for 18 years.

I'm grateful that my pets are in good health and content little creatures. We are a mutual admiration family on that front. We have a bundle of love and it's shared.

You probably have a great and long list of things you are grateful for this holiday week. Would you like to share? If so, please do. We have spent so many months together complaining about the world, let's take one day to share with one another what makes us happy.

Have a wonderful, safe and happy holiday. And as the greeting card says, Gobble 'till you Wobble.
Happy Thanksgiving to all.

Affectionately,
patricia

Jim Wallis on Meet the Press

This Sunday, Jim Wallis of Sojourners is going to be on Meet the Press. Remember him? God is not a Republican... or a Democrat ? He's going to talk about Moral Values.

"It's time to spark a real debate in this country over what the most important "religious issues" and "moral values" in politics are - and how broadly and deeply they are understood. Religion doesn't fall neatly into right and left categories. If there were ever candidates running with a strong set of personal moral values and a commitment to be pro-poor and pro-peace, it could build many bridges to the other side. Personal and social responsibility are both at the heart of religion, and the two together could make a very powerful and compelling political vision for the future of our bitterly divided nation. -Jim Wallis"


(hat tip: Chuck Currie)

Ironic Isn't It?

Some anti-war movement we have...
"What seems to be today's antiwar position — it was a terrible mistake and it's a terrible mess, but we can't just walk away from it — was actually the pro-war position during Vietnam. In fact, it was close to official government policy for more than half the length of that war." -LA Times

Israeli Soldiers Jealous of Abu Ghraib?
"...another officer, 'G', who asked to be photographed next to the severed head of the Palestinian. "Everyone laughed at the idea, and they put the head on a wooden pole like a scarecrow and one soldier even put a cigarette in the head's mouth." " Al-Jazeera

American Values
"We [Americans] are surrounded by poor and low-income people. (The definitions can be elastic and easily blurred, but essentially we're talking about individuals and families that don't have enough money to cover the essentials - food, shelter, clothing, transportation and so forth.) Many of them are full-time workers, and some have more than one job. " -NY times

US Republican Officials Shocked at Ukranian Stolen Election
"Western observers immediately denounced the election. Senator Richard Lugar, a Republican sent by President George Bush to monitor voting, accused the Ukrainian government of supporting a “concerted and forceful programme of election-day fraud and abuse”. " -The Economist

I told you it was a good browser.
"...Microsoft is promoting Mozilla Firefox. (inadvertently) The company recently provided the press with a screenshot of MSN Search displayed on the open source browser. Microsoft's PR firm denied using Firefox for any of MSN Search's screenshots.
Alert reader Dror Levin read a review of the new MSN Search on the Seattle Post Intelligencer. He noticed something strange about the screenshot in the article, found a larger version of it and was surprised to find out that while the OS was Windows XP, the browser used was Firefox. The photo credit says "(AP Photo/HO/Microsoft)", which menas it was distributed to AP by Microsoft. "

by blondesense

The Funniest Thing I Read All Week

"... every year, just before Christmas, she would schedule a mammogram, knowing she would not get the results until after the holidays. The remote possibility of cancer was something to hang over her children’s heads..."

From the New Yorker

Bitchin

by pissed off patricia

Christ on a Fish Stick

You Are The Heartland
A Letter to Liberal America
by Barbara Sumner Burstyn

www.dissidentvoice.org

November 22, 2004

Since the election my liberal inbox has been filled with screeds of hand-wringing articles dissecting the ascendancy of George W Bush. They all talk of winning back the heartland, reinvigorating true democracy, fighting the red-blue war of culture, ideology, politics and psychology. But for all the column inches steeped in despair there were very few action plans and even less insight. The reason is simple. Democrats and Republicans are feeding at the same trough.

Drive through the liberal enclaves of any privileged blue state or through the conservative interior of a red state and you see the same big houses – or aspirations of big houses and the same super-sized vehicles.

Open the door of a liberal or a conservative home (a double-wide trailer, a mansion or a New York loft, it doesn’t matter which) and you’ll find the same wide screen TV, the same huge sofa, the same gigantic refrigerator overstocked with pretty much the same food.

Perhaps you’ll find more organic labels in the liberal fridge but the abundance and out-of-season array will be the same. Check the labels on the clothes of a liberal or a conservative and you’ll see they are all made in the same out-sourced, third world sweatshop factories.

One commentator declared the forces of Bushim would eventually be overthrown. But overthrown with what? The polite man who changed his suites and even his ties to match the President, who participated in sham debates, who never once deviated from the script, even when the whole country was watching and he could have turned to the President and asked him the real questions?

Some commentators have bemoaned the choice of Kerry. But did you, the so-called liberal America really want someone different? Perhaps you supported Kerry, who is neither a revolutionary nor a man of vision because you wanted business as usual, you wanted your politics like your cappuccinos: fluffy and comforting.

That’s why the streets aren’t overflowing with protest. That’s why you’re not massing outside the corporate owned television stations demanding they retract their lies and rescind their self- censorship.

That’s why all the columns about fraudulent electoral practices are no more than hot air. Because actually no one wants the system to end, because despite the increasing numbers of poor and working poor, the vast and growing gap between the haves and have-nots, the majority of you are just too damn comfortable.

It’s the great hypocrisy of the American left. Take the very liberal Democrat supporting Sarah Jessica Parker. Pay her more money and she’s happy to re-voice the newly edited, sex-free Sex in the City to keep the heartland happy.

Or Will Smith, the actor who respectfully declined to be present at last year's Academy Awards, supposedly in protest for the war, is happy to make millions in a film like I Robot with a gun super-glued to his hand as he saves the world from yet another black and white evil, with barely a bad word for the corporate greed that created that evil.

That’s because making money is the American way. Because money trumps conviction every time. If you’re a liberal it’s a sign you’re successful in a secular way. If you’re a member of the new force of evangelical conservatives it’s a sign of Gods blessing.

Where I come from the choice between Kerry or Bush is called a Claytons choice: the choice you’re having when you’re not having a choice.

Would the anguish and torment of the Iraqi people have ended under a Democratic leader? Would the environment have been given the kind of urgent priority needed to slow global warming? Would the rights of pregnant women be respected? Would the price of gasoline have been raised so high that Americans would limit their driving? Would coal fired power plants have been forced to control their pollution? Would the coded double-speak rhetoric that says one thing and means another have ended? Would the pharmaceutical industry be called to heel? Would anything have changed in any significant way?

Republicans may have co-opted religion and promoted morality over economics, the environment and human rights. But how is that different from senior Democrats such as Senator Harry Reid of Nevada?

A tee-totaling Mormon who is about to become the conservative standard bearer of the party, Reid’s stand on abortion would drop women back into a dark age. Or California Democrat Senator Diane Feinstein who recently commented that she believes very strongly the voice of the moderates in caucus ought to have some sway (as if the Democrats were somehow extreme). Or Sheldon Silver the Democratic speaker of the Assembly who supports the death penalty. Or Hilary Clinton who is being advised to represent herself as moderately pro-life. Or the scramble, as outlined in the New York Times last week, by Democrats to organize the “religious left” and phrase their positions in more moral and religious terms.

The great con is the idea that having an election makes you a democracy, that your vote makes a difference. A difference to what? The ideology of profit as the highest motivation? Or to the fact that the invocation of religion and morality is no more than a smokescreen to hide the reality of corporate feudalism. That perfect system that ensures your serfdom while sating your senses with consumerism and numbing your awareness that your country is run by and for the corporations who are your real leaders and where in exchange for your compliance you get your every whim sated in a consumer hog heaven.

That’s why you don’t take your idols to task; your hypocritical movie stars, your lying, Teflon suited politicians, your liberal neighbor in his SUV. Yourself. So this is what I want to say to the liberals of America. You’re not going to win the heartland no matter how committed you are to the environment or equality or if your heart bleeds for the poor, or for the innocents of Iraq because you are the heartland. Every time you switch the remote, start your gasoline engine, stuff another McDonalds, chug on a Starbucks, down another anti-depressant, muscle relaxant, painkiller, or shop at The Gap, you are the heartland.

The 2004 election was not a revolution of the right or a failure of the left. It made no difference who you voted for, because until you recognize the conscription of your consumption and your obedience to it, until you smash your widescreens and your SUVs, until you renounce your comfort at any cost and all the other methods of your mass distraction you will get the government you deserve. Because you are the heartland.

Barbara Sumner Burstyn is an award winning freelance writer who commutes between Montreal, Quebec and The Hawkes Bay in New Zealand. She has contributed to a wide range of media, and is currently working on a new novel. She can be reached at: barb@sumnerburstyn.com. Visit her website to read more of her work: www.sumnerburstyn.com/. © 2004 Barbara Sumner Burstyn

Arnold? C'mon

I have no problem with constitutional reform, but amending the constitution for Arnold? Puhleese. Out of all the people in the whole country who came here from other lands, Arnold is the best person they can come up with to promote a constitutional amendment to change the birth requirement for the presidency? This is just wrong and disturbing on so many levels.

He's not real! He's an action figure.

But

Every country has the government it deserves.
- Joseph de Maistre

"Marines don't shoot rainbows out of our asses. We fucking kill people."

From the Village Voice by Evan Wright, an embedded reporter in 2003.


Here's a couple of paragraphs from the article. The entire article is a must read!

"The Marines constantly debated the morality of what they were engaged in. A sergeant in the platoon told me he had consulted with his priest about killing. The priest had told him it was all right to kill for his government so long as he didn't enjoy it. By the time the unit reached the outskirts of Baghdad, this sergeant was certain he had already killed at least four men. When his battalion commander praised the unit for "slaying dragons" on the way to Baghdad, the sergeant later told his men, "If we did half the shit back home we've done here, we'd be in prison." By then, the sergeant told me, he'd reconsidered what his priest had told him about killing. "Where the fuck did Jesus say it's OK to kill people for your government? Any priest who tells me that has got no credibility."

He and several other Marines recently returned from Iraq (many from their second tours) whom I've talked to about the Falluja shooting say they are not sure they would have dead-checked the wounded man in the mosque had they been in the same position. Most say they probably would have, even though the mosque had already been cleared once. "What does the American public think happens when they tell us to assault a city?" one of them said. "Marines don't shoot rainbows out of our asses. We fucking kill people."

Another Marine in the unit I followed—a Democrat's dream, he returned home from fighting in Falluja in time to vote for Kerry—added, "Americans celebrate war in their movies. We like to see visions of evil being defeated by good. When the people at home glimpse the reality of war, that it's a bloodbath, they freak out. We are a subculture they created and programmed to fight their wars. You have to become a psycho to kill like we do. To most Marines that guy in the mosque was just someone who didn't get hit in the right place the first time we shot him. I probably would have put a bullet in his brain if I'd been there. If the American public doesn't like the violence of war, maybe before they start the next war they shouldn't rush so much."

(it's worth your time to read the entire piece)

Proof That We Evolved From Monkeys

Holy Fucking Shit.

If anyone who voted for this asshole is reading this. Fuck you.
And you called Clinton, Bubba?
This dry drunk is pretending he's at a goddang hoe down and his fucking fly is open!

I went out this morning to do some errands and I have to come home to this? It's thanksgiving week and I am trying to be thankful for something, anything, and this is the thanks I get from Chimpy McFlydown. Thank you Peter of LoneTree for bringing it to my attention. And a happy thanksgiving to you too.

First he's all macho with his SS guy, then he poses in the Juan Valdez look alike contest (see below) and now this. How can we send this boy anywhere?

What country am I in? Have I been so secluded living in New York? I must be. I had no idea Americans were such simpletons. We evolved from monkeys, dammit. Get over it.

Dammit, I want a northerner for the next president. I have nothing against southerner presidents because Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton were real charmers, but it's time we had someone who represented the cold liberal states. I'm just saying...
What the hell was wrong with windsurfing? That's what coastal living people do. It's not elitist to do water sports and it's not a northern thing. Do we make fun of tractor pulls?
Don't answer that.

Now someone tell me some good news.

UPDATE: Peter sent me more news. I don't know if it's good. It's news and I am not steaming from it. So that's good. It seems that a hypnotherapist in Boca Raton Florida is making money curing depressed people who voted for Kerry. heh. Anyway, he was doing really well and making lots of money until the people found out that Ohio is being recounted and now they are feeling better and don't need to be hypnotized in order to accept bush as their lord and savior.
Government Accountability Office to Conduct Investigation of 2004 Election Irregularities

Ok, so cheer up you depressed people. Snap out of it.

Surrender?

Never!

You might check out this pledge sponsored by Working Assets. I signed it.

"Take the pledge to Never Surrender"

Bitchin'

by pissed off patricia

That's What I'm Talkin' About

See, this is what I was talking about yesterday in my post, "Bitchin' in the Afternoon, The Three Billion Dollar Ass Kiss." I wrote: No one mentioned that perhaps the illegal drug trafficking was down in Colombia because maybe, just perhaps, it's because it's really picked up in Afghanistan.

Robert Scheer:
Cultivating Opium, Not Democracy
Afghanistan's crop 'has spread like wildfire.'

***

See, this is what I was talking about the other day when I wrote about what happens to some babies after they leave the womb. In my post "Doves Have No Talons and Neither Do I," I wrote: I also believe there is more to birth and life than exiting a womb. There is the life outside the womb and for some babies, that's a hell unto itself.

"I cut her arms off," Schlosser replied, as the hymn "He Touched Me" played in the background."

ABC News : Mother Charged With Murder After Telling 911 Operator She Had Cut Off Baby's Arms

***

In light of the deer hunter killing (now it's six people) and this woman cutting her baby's arms off allowing it to bleed to death, explain to me why human beings shouldn't be considered nature's most despicable and dangerous creatures. Yes, of course I know all human beings are not awful, but some surely are. Before we set off to fix the world, I think more time should be devoted to fixing ourselves.

That blinding glow you see just may be the sun reflecting off our own glass house.